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Post by randy on Aug 7, 2012 0:44:37 GMT -6
Lets go back to 1946 the year I was born by the way. We had just won WWII and were vertually untouched by war physically as a country. We had the bomb and a mighty fleet and airforce. As a world power our planes could darken the sky and out fleet numbered thousands of ships. We were the leader of the world. We chose to hold a world meeting in SF to plan the post war world. Readers of my posts know that I feel that the first contact officially with the world powers happened at this meeting how ever perhaps there was contact during the war years leading up to this presentation. There had to be a lead in time. It is possible that just enough alien tech was passed on to the US give us the edge in nuclear weapons. the greys may have been tracking the process developing in each waring country and chose sides having evaluated the leadership in each country. We were the less blood thirsty in the long run of the major powers. Just an idea tossed out for dicussion
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god
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Post by god on Aug 7, 2012 8:09:08 GMT -6
Lets go back to 1946 the year I was born by the way. We had just won WWII and were vertually untouched by war physically as a country. We had the bomb and a mighty fleet and airforce. As a world power our planes could darken the sky and out fleet numbered thousands of ships. We were the leader of the world. We chose to hold a world meeting in SF to plan the post war world. Readers of my posts know that I feel that the first contact officially with the world powers happened at this meeting how ever perhaps there was contact during the war years leading up to this presentation. There had to be a lead in time. It is possible that just enough alien tech was passed on to the US give us the edge in nuclear weapons. the greys may have been tracking the process developing in each waring country and chose sides having evaluated the leadership in each country. We were the less blood thirsty in the long run of the major powers. Just an idea tossed out for dicussion Oppenheimer would be really mad if he saw this post. GOD
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Post by paulette on Aug 7, 2012 10:39:11 GMT -6
Ha! If the greys gave the US the bomb, they didn't give them operating instructions. There was the poor guy who would play with two half spheres of plutonium (which in itself was going to be his demise). One day he got them too close together and they fissioned.
He was mortally burned and the other scientists kept vigil over him - to make sure he didn't sure anything. I'm sure most of the people involved in the Manhatten Project surcome to radiation induced illnesses.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 7, 2012 12:41:40 GMT -6
Oppenheimer would be turning over in his grave over that one. Although..I have heard it haunted him to his death that he had been responsible for the death of so many.
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Post by paulette on Aug 7, 2012 16:27:49 GMT -6
No way one could escape the repercussions of killing millions of civilians. So far, the greatest "collateral damage" that I know of. Einstein suffered over the fact that his "pure math" was part of it. What was also part of it were rocket scientists spirited out of Germany in the last days and given new identities (and jobs) in the USA. I don't know about Oppenheimer...? A quote: "I am become death, the destroyer of worlds." - J. Robert Oppenheimer Read more at www.brainyquote.com/quotes/authors/j/j_robert_oppenheimer.html#5iM9iPhJC25dV5tV.99And: "In some sort of crude sense, which no vulgarity, no humor, no overstatement can quite extinguish, the physicists have known sin; and this is a knowledge which they cannot lose." - J. Robert Oppenheimer Read more at www.brainyquote.com/quotes/authors/j/j_robert_oppenheimer.html#Z6pByS5uqgqDhkhP.99
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Post by Deleted on Aug 7, 2012 16:43:00 GMT -6
No way one could escape the repercussions of killing millions of civilians. So far, the greatest "collateral damage" that I know of. Einstein suffered over the fact that his "pure math" was part of it. What was also part of it were rocket scientists spirited out of Germany in the last days and given new identities (and jobs) in the USA. I don't know about Oppenheimer...? A quote: "I am become death, the destroyer of worlds." - J. Robert Oppenheimer Read more at www.brainyquote.com/quotes/authors/j/j_robert_oppenheimer.html#5iM9iPhJC25dV5tV.99And: "In some sort of crude sense, which no vulgarity, no humor, no overstatement can quite extinguish, the physicists have known sin; and this is a knowledge which they cannot lose." - J. Robert Oppenheimer Read more at www.brainyquote.com/quotes/authors/j/j_robert_oppenheimer.html#Z6pByS5uqgqDhkhP.99I was thinking the same thing when reading this article earlier. Wernher Von Braun came to my mind. Though he is basically the man responsible for our success's in space exploration both yesterday and still today with his abilities in rocket engineering, he still had to live with knowing it was the V2's that he engineered and developed for the Nazi's which bombed London. He later surrendered to the Americans where his background sort of was "erased" and then given a roll in the then secret Operation Paperclip.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 7, 2012 17:41:57 GMT -6
We have our own history both horrifying and proud. I think the 'grey's' have influenced enough with abductions and testing..there isn't anything to indicate they 'take over' people or influence politicians or build bombs or disguise themselves as santa at Christmas. We have to own our own stupidity and mistakes not blame them on evil aliens
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Post by skywalker on Aug 7, 2012 18:58:02 GMT -6
The nuclear bomb program was first thought of by the Nazis as part of their attempt to take over the world. The only reason we got it first is because many of Germany's best scientists were Jews and they did not like what Hitler was doing to their fellow people so they defected to the US and brought knowledge of the bomb project with them. Imagine what would have happened if the Nazis had succeded in building the bomb.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 7, 2012 22:02:53 GMT -6
Can you say heil Hitler?
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Post by plutronus on Aug 8, 2012 0:39:32 GMT -6
No way one could escape the repercussions of killing millions of civilians. So far, the greatest "collateral damage" that I know of. Einstein suffered over the fact that his "pure math" was part of it. What was also part of it were rocket scientists spirited out of Germany in the last days and given new identities (and jobs) in the USA. I don't know about Oppenheimer...? A quote: "I am become death, the destroyer of worlds." - J. Robert Oppenheimer Read more at www.brainyquote.com/quotes/authors/j/j_robert_oppenheimer.html#5iM9iPhJC25dV5tV.99And: "In some sort of crude sense, which no vulgarity, no humor, no overstatement can quite extinguish, the physicists have known sin; and this is a knowledge which they cannot lose." - J. Robert Oppenheimer Read more at www.brainyquote.com/quotes/authors/j/j_robert_oppenheimer.html#Z6pByS5uqgqDhkhP.99 Hi Paulette,
Its true that many of the folks who were the main shakers and movers of the bomb...development, expressed remorse and felt great responsibility for their creations' usage. I suspect anyone who is involved in weapons development may feel a similar sentiment. Imagine being the developer of say, a cluster bomb? Or grenades? However, and in another vantage, folks such as Einstein or Oppenheimer or Teller, all of these folks, frankly, due to their exalted social positions within the intelligentsia of the world's society, did not directly experience the one-on-one carnage being experienced by American foot-soldiers who were fighting, slugging it through to stop the murderous advance of the Japanese Imperial Army pushing through islands for the American shores. Its not well known that the Japanese occupied the Kodiak Islands in Alaska, or that they occupied the Channel Islands a mere 12 miles off the coast of Santa Barbara California. They could not maintain an overt invasion as they had not established the requisite material supply chain through the Pacific Islands. Only the up-close, blood and guts of our young men stopped their advance, else history would likely be much different today. We can allow the Openheimers and the Tellers their moral dilemas, while the old soldiers wrestle with the rememberances in their dreams of the blood and guts scattered around the jungles, the remains of their fallen comrades and friends in their hours of terror.
Re; the notion of 'collateral-damage' inflicted by the detonation of the atomic bombs on Japan:
The first bomb hit its primary target, which was the same category of target planned for the second atomic bomb mission.
The second bomb missed its intended target(s). The bomb was so heavy that the airplane did not have enough fuel to return it to base for a second run and they were ordered to not waste it. They had to drop it on Japan. The pilot & bombardier could not see the land through the clouds (before GPS, --were within 30~50 miles of the target more or less), as the flight crew had been ordered to maintain radio-silence, it was decided by the crew to blindly drop the bomb through clouds as long as it was over Japan. The bomb detonated (atmospheric) over a highly military-industrial manufacturing area, it was a complete miss, while the intended primary and secondary targets, which they could not find, were specifically intended to be the bedroom areas of Japan...the target, the people of Japn, --the elderly, the mommas, the playgrounds, the schools, the libraries, the gardens, et cetera areas. The 'collateral-areas' in today's military thinking. The war weary American military planners (who had sent millions of young Americans to their combat deaths) were sending a message to the Japanese Country's leaders and the Japanese People as a whole, 'end the war'. The alternative? An estimated one million more American Troops would die, forced to engage the Japanese forces in the heretofore, extremely costly (Human carnage, blood, guts, flesh littering the landscape) and fierce hand-to-hand combat, as had been occurring all across the Pacific Ocean and associated Japanese entrenched Pacific islands, --Tarawa, Kajaliene, Guam, Marshall (Mom's Uncle) Islands, Ryukian, Okinawa, etc...all the way back to Japan. Then one need remember, that there was a deep rooted in blood dislike for the Japanese soldiers, and consequently the society that bred them, the people. All owing to the horrible mistreatments inflicted on foreign prisoners of war through out history...for instance, they always raped the nurses and the women of the villages before beheading them, --being 'animals' for their pleasure. The Japanese were infamous for their maltreatment of the Chinese, and the Filipinos People. Then there was that little matter of Bataan. These things were fresh in the minds of the folks who planned the bombs. Perhaps a bit of payback? Stick their hands in the fire for a change.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bataan_death_march
In time,fortunately people forget the reasons, the motivations, the drive...however, eventually and hopefully, hate will morph into collaborations, friendships and love....likely when everyone who lived those dark times have become the dust of the ages.
Hopefully, we can learn from history and not do it all over again.
Recently I was chatting with a Californian who was evacuated from the coast of Japan as result of Japan's recent killer tsunami. He had been living in Japan teaching English there. Seems, Japanese really love blondes. He told me that he frequently met young Japanese who know nothing about World War II. And when he told them about it, they frequently ask, "Who won?"
plutronus
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Post by Deleted on Aug 8, 2012 0:48:17 GMT -6
I can see it might not be a favorite in history for them..rather tragic for us all.
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Post by skywalker on Aug 8, 2012 22:21:00 GMT -6
I bet there are a lot of people in this country who don't know who won either. Our "education" system is pathetic...especially when it comes to history. The truth about what happened and why is no longer even discussed. Now it is all either popular history, which is what people want to believe happened, or propaganda, which is what the government wants people to believe happened. True history in a lot of cases has been lost to time which is why countries all over the world are now repeating the exact same mistakes that were made back in the 1920s and 30s which lead to the Great Depression, the Nazis and WW2.
Those who refuse to learn from history are doomed to repeat it.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 8, 2012 23:23:59 GMT -6
Ain't that the truth! We learn from mistakes we make..(well some do) and if the kids aren't learning the past..the future is already shot
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Post by randy on Aug 9, 2012 0:10:12 GMT -6
The timing is the whole point of what I threw out for discussion. In the mid 1950s when I was in the Novato base as a kid it was in the finally construction phase. Most of it was already established. I have estimated that at least ten years would have been needed to build it from scratch or a small start from WWII era military operations. that would have put its start about 1946 or a few years earlier in WWII. The world meeting in 1946 in SF was handy for introductions to the major powers. Swaziland would not told but Russia would. The greys obviously picked us for siting a base. They showed interest in us. During the lead in time to building the Novato base we created the bomb. What a coincidence. Germany and Japan both were working on building one. We won the race. having a relationship with the greys they could have influenced that race. During WWII Japanese troops commonly engaged in cannibalism viewing our troops as dinner. This was hidden from the folks at home as it was considered to horrible to let out. This habit was picked up in China. My father experienced the island fighting and told me about the bodies floating in the drinking water, the smell of death and the general horrors of war. he had photos of scattered body parts in a gully that was typical of things. this was the alternative to using the bomb to ending the war. Japan wanted to surrender and tried to use Russia to deliver the message Russia sat on it to gain time to take over more of manchuria to establish a communist China Sky walker I agree on the lack of knowledge of history by the general population. in college I never found a person who could name five battles of the civil war.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 9, 2012 1:56:16 GMT -6
in college I never found a person who could name five battles of the civil war. Did you ever hear about zagonyi's charge in Springfield, Mo. ? One of my favorites of the Civil War. It happened not too far from where I live. ************************************************************ To be completely open minded about this, knowing the telepathic capabilities the greys have, it could be possible that some of the ideas were planted into the minds of some of these scientists and engineers but I tend to personally believe that it was mankinds sole mistakes which developed this 'technology'. I still wouldn't put it past these little critters though.
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Post by skywalker on Aug 9, 2012 7:10:29 GMT -6
Giving humans the atom bomb would be like giving a hand grenade to a monkey. You know something will get blown up sooner or later but there's no telling what.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 9, 2012 7:37:18 GMT -6
Just to add my '2 cents': This is one of my areas of study (though I have been sidetracked ). I'm not saying that these "thoughts or dreams" come from the greys. In fact, I hadn't considered that possibility. I've mentioned before, that in books, especially old ones, the author or who they are writing about acknowledges that at one point of their own study, investigations, etc., they became "stumped". After prayer, or what-have-you, the same individual then was "given" some sort of idea/dream/key that sometimes moved them into a totally opposite direction, but ultimately helped them. When a book is reprinted, this detail is left out. Some people would prefer to think that we humans do everything on our own.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 9, 2012 16:12:40 GMT -6
I don't think any races from elsewhere would introduce anything with such a destructive capability to a 'baby' race. Considering the relationship we might have dimensionally..it would be very irresponsible and who knows what kind of damage we might have already done to dimensions parallel to our own with the ones we've detonated or astral dimensions even. We act like we are the only ones who matter..a selfish lot of brats. Then we try to blame it on everyone else instead of owning it and growing from it. No I don't think other races would tolerate us being given bad boom booms.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 9, 2012 22:52:26 GMT -6
And there you touched on something else I wonder. . .
Have we invited or opened doorways with our bombs to things that shouldn't be here??
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Post by skywalker on Aug 9, 2012 23:42:31 GMT -6
Right after they blew those things up in 1945 was when the UFOs started showing up in mass in 1947. They definitely got somebody's attention. Don't know if any dimensional doorways were open during the blast though. I suppose it's possible. Lots of weird stuff has been showing up lately.
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Post by randy on Aug 10, 2012 0:17:27 GMT -6
Known fact at least to me the base exists and I was in it in mid 1950s also it takes time to build such a place and the feds were involved as I saw with my own eyes. World meeting was in SF in 1946 only a few miles from the base. IN Jr College i saw a 1946 geologic map of Marin co that showed a tunnel in the hill where the landing bay was located with a question mark. They knew a tunnel was there but did not know why as indicated on the ledgend of the map later versions of the map deleate the tunnel. During this time we created the bomb. Many people have had dreams that inspired great discoveries. I recall a man sleeping in the desert who in a dream was told to dig down 23 ft to find great wealth he dug and found a rich mine. A railroad being built to Galveston was suddenly diverted to another port as the owner had a dream Galveston was destroyed by a flood and it was destroyed. A man trying to figure out the atomic structure of what he was studying had a dream of devils pulling him in a pattern that he checked out and that was the atomic structure he was looking for Inspiration comes in many forms making a leap in logic can be created some times As far as time portals to change subjects I have mentioned both myself and my sister at the little big horn battle field both separately felt horses around us and heard a hammering noise i heard also rising and falling of sound while my sister said she heard screaming. I followed this noise down a gully until I got scared that I would step back in time to the battle and being a kid that was no place for me. Something wierd was going there.
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Post by plutronus on Aug 10, 2012 2:53:11 GMT -6
I don't think any races from elsewhere would introduce anything with such a destructive capability to a 'baby' race. Considering the relationship we might have dimensionally..it would be very irresponsible and who knows what kind of damage we might have already done to dimensions parallel to our own with the ones we've detonated or astral dimensions even. We act like we are the only ones who matter..a selfish lot of brats. Then we try to blame it on everyone else instead of owning it and growing from it. No I don't think other races would tolerate us being given bad boom booms. Hi JoKelly,
<<< I don't think races from elsewhere would introduce anything with such a destructive capability to a 'baby' race. >>>
Quite true, but they might eat us.
It is a generally accepted opinion within the scientific 'invisible-college' underground (scientists who secretly study ET presence) that there exist curious parallels between Human live-stock management and that of alien behaviors. For instance, Robert Bigelow's ET Field Unit Director, formerly a Johns Hopkins cancer research scientist, Colm Kelleher, who wrote, (14 wks on NYBSL), 'Brain Trust'. The book is an expose of the history of long-onset prion diseases, (such as Alzheimer) as well as their mysterious distribution within the World's cattle stocks and of the strange surgical-precision cattle mutilation events coincident with activity of often seen 'black-helicopters' that exhibit no ground-effect. There is no reference to ET in the book, it is a scholarly read. Also, another glimpse may be had via Roy Dutton's ET object database analysis research (~1995, both the data and the program are currently owned by Robert Bigelow). Roy Dutton a UK engineer, via an old Art Bell Dreamland (a show that was funded by Robert Bigelow) interview said, "my database clearly illustrates that ET employ complicated interleaved navigation patterns, that in my opinion, are used in a strategy designed to confuse Human observers. Using my data-set, an operator may select a date and a time 'search-key', for which my database will generate a latitude and longitude coordinate-set that predicts time and location that an alien object sighting will occur somewhere within the Earth's atmosphere. It seems to be something like a production-line conveyor-belt, --should one remain at one location long enough, the belt will return to that location repetitively, after making numerous stops elsewhere." Roy Dutton won Robert Bigelow's (NIDS) first prize ($50,000) 'Best UFO Essay Contest', using his ET object database program he wrote for tracking alien object movements.
plutronus
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Post by Deleted on Aug 10, 2012 10:20:17 GMT -6
Oh I've always figured one option could be the earth as a fast food source. I imagine if that were the case there would be a lot more harvesting going on..rather than select abductions but that doesn't mean there's not some race on it's way to the deli. ;D
You're right Sky that after the bomb testing, ships really started showing up. Could be from other dimensions worried about possible effects on their worlds or just a lot of races worried about the primitive monkeys with nuclear capability. I'd be worried too. We have no idea how many memories we have are 'planted' ones or real happenings because they're so good at mind games. I think we did open doorways and let in critters (mothman, jersey devil, etc) and I think we opened ourselves up as lab rats. Don't drink the water?
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Post by Deleted on Aug 12, 2012 14:43:07 GMT -6
Somewhere, I've previously heard the idea of conveyor belt and UFOs returning to the same places over and over. . .
I know that some predictions in this area have been proven. But then we have the personal so-called interactions. Implants, and "calling" abductees to places could be made to "fit", but then we go back to our thoughts on some "aliens" protecting us?
I have so many questions.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 12, 2012 14:50:45 GMT -6
As far as time portals to change subjects I have mentioned both myself and my sister at the little big horn battle field both separately felt horses around us and heard a hammering noise i heard also rising and falling of sound while my sister said she heard screaming. I followed this noise down a gully until I got scared that I would step back in time to the battle and being a kid that was no place for me. Something wierd was going there. Yeah, you might be changing subjects here . But what gets me, is you instinctively (I guess-or had a "voice" tell you internally) knew that you were in a weird, abnormal situation. You "knew" that somehow you had done some time-traveling. I think that most likely you did this more than once. Like, you don't have an actual memory of where you went other times, maybe because someone tampered with your memories, but yet part of you "knowing" was a memory thing. I don't know how else to put it.
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Post by randy on Aug 12, 2012 23:42:02 GMT -6
Going down the gully at little bighorn battlefield the noise was becoming clearer and the feeling of fear became over whelming for me as a kid. I wanted to see but I felt too much fear to go on. I was white and the indians won that battle. Earlier I had stood at the grave site of some of the soldiers killed there and tried to mentally contact them saying "Rally the 7th" over and over again I wanted to rally any residual spirits that were there to give them a focal point. I did not think anything had happened until I walked up the path and felt horses around me. It was disstinctly horses that both I and later my sister felt there. One soldier listed as buried there has a name almost like mine so I was interested in raising his spirit in particular. I was open to contact. Was there a time portal there I dont know but it happened to me and my sister separately. I dont want to be a white guy at the little big horn battle.
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