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Post by Deleted on Feb 27, 2011 17:52:19 GMT -6
This is kind of for you Sky, knowing how you feel about the worlds finest government...I knew you would 'appreciate' this and it's some really bad stuff ATLANTA – Shocking as it may seem, U.S. government doctors once thought it was fine to experiment on disabled people and prison inmates. Such experiments included giving hepatitis to mental patients in Connecticut, squirting a pandemic flu virus up the noses of prisoners in Maryland, and injecting cancer cells into chronically ill people at a New York hospital. |
For the rest of this article news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20110227/ap_on_he_me/us_med_experiments_on_humans
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Post by skywalker on Feb 27, 2011 19:51:26 GMT -6
Thanks for the article, Jo. I will add these examples to the long, long list I have that contains all of the other reasons why I hate the government. These types of inhuman atrocities should have everybody outraged, and it is outrageous that people are not outraged. We supposedly go to war to put a stop to things like this in other countries, and then we do the same types of things in our own country. I bet if the politicians were being used as Guinea pigs they wouldn't allow it.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 27, 2011 21:29:03 GMT -6
I think sometimes the expression is right that 'everyone has a price'. I'm not so sure I would be so against experimentation on pedophiles.
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Post by skywalker on Feb 27, 2011 22:30:44 GMT -6
Anything can be justified if people try hard enough to justify it. Just look at all of the horrible things people do every day. They wouldn't do them if they didn't think they were right.
Hitler thought he was doing a good thing by eliminating the Jews, and other people who were not of the "Master race." He believed that if he got rid of those people with physical or mental imperfections then the only people left would be tall, strong, intelligent, hard-working, productive people, and society would be better off as a result of it. If you look at it strictly from a logical point of view he was correct, but does that justify the murder of tens of millions of people, even if it is for the greater good of the country? I don't think so.
As far as pedophiles go, I don't like them either, but I don't think they should be used as Guinea pigs, not unless you want to fry a Guinea pig in the electric chair or string him up from the nearest tree. I'm not too fond of criminals who hurt innocent people...especially when those criminals are political leaders or people in positions of power.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 27, 2011 23:52:30 GMT -6
I have a special feeling for anyone who harms or hurts a child...and I didn't really mean anyone should experiment on anyone without given consent no matter who or why. I'm not quite that callous. I've mentioned before the experiments that were done to my cousin when he was in the service that left him a paranoid/schizophrenic...I have no love for government games either. Do they think they're right? I think they know perfectly well they're in the wrong and do it anyway, justifying it in whatever way they need to. Hitler..I think was mad as a hatter and absolutely evil. I can't understand personally why anyone could be fascinated with a butcher. Granted..he didn't personally bloody his hands..but he gave the orders and gave free rein to those who would carry them out. He was just as determined to rid the world of Gypsies as Jews (he killed over 500,000 of them). Every so often some blob of something horrible lets loose a Hitler, or a Sadam or the commander at Fort Clark who gave small pox infected blankets to Indians. The government just isn't using blankets now days (more on the reference to the Indians) www.plagiary.org/smallpox-blankets.pdf
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Post by bewildered on Feb 28, 2011 11:11:14 GMT -6
Anything can be justified if people try hard enough to justify it. Just look at all of the horrible things people do every day. They wouldn't do them if they didn't think they were right. Hitler thought he was doing a good thing by eliminating the Jews, and other people who were not of the "Master race." He believed that if he got rid of those people with physical or mental imperfections then the only people left would be tall, strong, intelligent, hard-working, productive people, and society would be better off as a result of it. If you look at it strictly from a logical point of view he was correct, but does that justify the murder of tens of millions of people, even if it is for the greater good of the country? I don't think so. As far as pedophiles go, I don't like them either, but I don't think they should be used as Guinea pigs, not unless you want to fry a Guinea pig in the electric chair or string him up from the nearest tree. I'm not too fond of criminals who hurt innocent people...especially when those criminals are political leaders or people in positions of power. Well said. Understanding the viewpoint and framing of another is not itself a justification of their viewpoint or frame of reference; rather, it is how we might learn to execute accurate judgment. Appearances, as they say, can be deceiving. How do we judge a man who steals food for his family? Thievery is against the law; however, is feeding those who depend on you against any law? No wrong makes a right, and something right is not wrong. If only we were able to perceive the consequences of our every action, no matter how crucial or inconsequential...perhaps then we would truly learn what is right and what is wrong. As it is, those concepts spring from perspective: the man who steals bread is desperate and is willing to risk the consequences of theft so that his family might eat and survive another day. In the eyes of the law, however, he is a criminal and worthy of prosecution. We perceive the imposition of one's will upon another as evil; the tragedy is magnified if the one subjected has no voice to protest or arm to raise in their own defense. Does the cow have a choice as it is led to slaughter? What can the tree say as it is cut down? What of the devoted mother who is taken from her family suddenly and without warning? Creatures are made to suffer so that others might live. Some of the most valued and treasured advancements of medicine were achieved at the expense of the innocent...those with no voice to protest, nor arms to raise in defiance of their oppressor. How can we commend one evil while condemning another? These are questions I ask when I consider the things some (such as governments) do in the name of this or that...and then ponder the things that I do in the name of this or that. Is there really any difference?
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Post by skywalker on Feb 28, 2011 14:03:18 GMT -6
Very well spoken, BW. I agree totally. Laws are only as good as the people who make them and some do more damage than good, even though they may have been made with the best of intentions.
I personally have a much more simplistic view of what should and should not be against the law. If it hurts somebody else than it is wrong and people should not do it. I don't need some law to tell me the difference between right and wrong.
It seems the people running our government are not always able to make that distinction, even when they do have a law telling them what is and is not okay. I noticed while reading that article that even when these abusive types of medical experiments were outlawed here in the US the experimenters just went to other countries to conduct them. I guess they think the lives of people living in Africa or South America are less valuable than the lives of people living here in the United States. Or could it be that they just don't care one way or another?
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Post by Deleted on Feb 28, 2011 16:36:58 GMT -6
When did humanity become so expendable, cannon fodder or collateral damage? It's a bit like that...or the needs of the many outweighing the needs of the few (that one comes from the bible in slightly altered text). It's one thing to make a heroic sacrifice it's another to have someone decide you would make a more valuable contribution dead...or as a lab rat. Course..that may be what we are to other races visiting.
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Post by skywalker on Mar 7, 2011 15:29:50 GMT -6
The article said that the Associated Press did a review that found forty cases where people had been used as Guinea pigs in these types of experiments. Has that review ever been published anywhere? I would like to see it if it has but I can't seem to find it anywhere.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 7, 2011 17:06:46 GMT -6
The article said that the Associated Press did a review that found forty cases where people had been used as Guinea pigs in these types of experiments. Has that review ever been published anywhere? I would like to see it if it has but I can't seem to find it anywhere. Imagine that....
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Post by auntym on Nov 12, 2017 13:06:43 GMT -6
mysteriousuniverse.org/2017/11/bizarre-government-experiments-and-strange-psychic-powers/ Bizarre Government Experiments and Strange Psychic Powersby Brent Swancer / mysteriousuniverse.org/author/brentswancer/November 12, 2017 Do we humans harbor within us vast mental powers beyond our imagination? Are some of us gifted with psychic abilities far beyond the norm, and if so what does that mean for us as a society? Whether one believes in extra sensory perception, mental powers, or any of the phenomena that go with them, some governments of the world have certainly at some point or another taken notice to entertain the idea. After all, wouldn’t such amazing abilities be useful for warfare or intelligence gathering? Governments around the world have long sought to try and harness the untapped powers of the human mind to mixed results, and here are some of the oddest such experiments, which were perhaps surprisingly taken quite seriously in their time, perhaps not to be dismissed out of hand. Although it had dabbled in extra sensory perception abilities in the 40s and 50s, the United States government began to truly pursue the potential application of psychic powers in warfare starting from the 1970s, when the U.S. Army, CIA, and Defense Intelligence Agency established a special unit at Fort Meade, Maryland, for the purpose of investigating psychic phenomena. Ordered by Maj. Gen. Edmund Thompson, then the Army’s top intelligence officer, and overseen by a Lt. Frederick Holmes “Skip” Atwater and later on Maj. Gen. Albert Stubblebine, what would be variously called Grill Flame, Sun Streak, and ultimately eventually fall under the general blanket code name of Project Stargate began here, and one of the main original focuses of the research was into what is referred to as “remote viewing,” or basically the ability for a psychic operative to observe and describe places, information, or objects from afar. The great potential military application for this sort of thing is obvious, and the U.S. government pursued it with vigor, believing that the Soviets were also engaged in such research and vice versa, essentially setting off a sort of “psychic arms race,” so to speak. One part of an overview of the project that is part of declassified documents stated: Driven by the notion that the Soviets might develop capabilities in this area, key personalities in the intelligence community were determined to explore the potential usefulness of psychic phenomena.It was not a particular extravagant affair at first, poorly funded, run out of an old, decrepit barracks and only employing around 20 people or less in the beginning, and although there were certainly those in the military who thought it was all a bonkers, crackpot idea, the organization itself was very serious about what they were investigating. Psychics were recruited to the program, who then underwent scientific tests of their supposed abilities and programs to try and hone them in order to basically create an army of psychic spies. One former researcher with the program describes what they did thus: In short, it involved placing an individual in a controlled darkened environment, descending him or her into a self-hypnotic trance and causing him/her to vocally describe images and other impressions that came to mind,” according to the overview. “In an intelligence context, the subject would be given some parameters of a target area or an intelligence question and the subject’s verbalization would be closely monitored.There were a few stand out supposed successes within the secretive program in the over 20 years that it existed. In 1974, a soviet site called Semipalatinsk, located in present day Kazakhstan was targeted as a suspicious location by the U.S. government for reasons it did not seem willing to discuss. Not much was known about the location at the time, and a remote viewer with the program was tasked with trying to get a peek at what was going on in there. The viewer was given the coordinates of the site, after which he managed to draw a layout of buildings and a surprisingly massive crane, and stated that it seemed to be a facility for perhaps housing missiles underground. Amazingly, satellite imagery would later confirm this, perfectly matching what the psychic had drawn out during his visions. In 1976, the remote viewers were tasked with the mission of trying to track down the whereabouts of a downed Soviet bomber, which had gone down into the wilds of Africa and vanished into the jungle. The CIA came to Stargate in desperation more than anything else, as all other attempts to locate the missing plane had met with failure, including satellite imaging, ground searches, and human intelligence. One psychic named Rosemary Smith, who also happened to be a secretary at Wright Patterson Air Force Base in Ohio, managed to conjure up location of the downed plane to within a few miles. A team was sent to the area that she had described and discovered the crash site, an unbelievable feat and no one was able to figure out how this woman could have possibly produced this intelligence that no one else could. It was seen as evidence that the technique could work. In another instance in 1979, a man once only known as Remote Viewer #1, who was actually named Joseph McMoneagle, under deep hypnosis described what he saw at the coordinates given to him by his handler. He explained that he could see a low, grey windowless building wreathed in the stench of sulphur, which he then drew onto some paper. This same image would be reproduced independently by a Remote Viewer #29, with the two drawn images being strikingly similar and the added detail that the place had numerous pieces of heavy machinery and that there was smelting of some sort going on. In both cases, the descriptions and the drawings closely matched a Chinese nuclear complex called Lop Nor, which was located in those coordinates and which neither of the men had ever seen with their own eyes, nor had had any contact with each other. Also in 1979 was the case of remote viewers from an offshoot of the program called Detachment G to look into a shadowy and secret Soviet Naval base. In this case, the psychics were able to describe seeing a drab building along the sea which stank of gasoline and harbored a weapon of some sort that looked like a “shark.” Later, satellite imagery would show that the base indeed held a massive new type of nuclear class of submarine that the Soviets called the Akula, which means “shark” in Russian. In 1987 the remote viewers were used to try and track down a CIA mole, and several of the viewers were able to divine the information that the man lived in Washington, was married to a Latin American woman, likely from Colombia, and drove an expensive foreign car. When the mole was found to be an Aldrich Ames in 1994 it was found that he did indeed live in Washington, was married to a Columbian, and drove a Jaguar. Spookily, the psychics had detailed this nearly a decade before. Cases such as these kept the top secret agency going, with the government pumping an estimated $20 million into their activities. However, for all of these alleged successes there were just as many failures or instances where things were ambiguous to say the least. Attempts to use the viewers to locate the whereabouts of Libyan leader Muammar Gaddafi in 1986, fugitive Panamanian dictator Manuel Noriega after the U.S. invasion of the country, attempts to locate certain weapons of war, and efforts to locate prisoners of war still kept after the Vietnam War, among others, all failed to produce any actionable intelligence or useful information at all. On top of this, despite the occasional successes there were just too many instances of false positives and vague, confused, irrelevant, ambiguous, or flat out wrong data to make psychic powers a viable pursuit at the time. This led the CIA to conclude that the technique was not worth pursuing for intelligence gathering purposes, and that it was not ready for any real, trustworthy application in the field. Simply put, it was deemed to be more trouble than it was worth. CONTINUE READING: mysteriousuniverse.org/2017/11/bizarre-government-experiments-and-strange-psychic-powers/
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