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Post by paulette on Mar 15, 2011 0:04:58 GMT -6
OK. I've got to post about this. There seems to be a huge weird quiet about this. There are 3 nuclear reactors on the Japanese coast in partial or total melt-down and 2 not far behind. Somewhere I read that each reactor if it goes totally critical = 1000 Hiroshimas. One of the reactors apparently has fuel grade plutonium in it. So far the releases have probably been mostly tritium (a radioactive isotope of hydrogen) that has a short half life (12 days) and slight penetrating power (inhaling it not good however). They have moved the Japanese civilians from 10 to 20 kilometers away and are scanning them for radiation. (No report of what happens if one "fails" the scan.)
The trade winds will bring any radiation released into the atmosphere to the west coast of North America in somewhere betwee 3 and 7 days. The "bullseye" is Oregon/Washington/BC. In short, where I live.
The shelves are now empty of iodide and anything else that sounds even faintly helpful including kelp pills which, according to the News, one would have to take a bottle every day to keep one's nonradioactive iodide topped up. Otherwise one's thyroid takes in the radioactive material and gets internally radiated.
Is anyone but me scared yet? I wonder why I didn't buy iodide (not iodine apparently) and why my government suggests that people not stockpile nor take it. As if they would tell us if we needed it or even supply it (like Japan is as I type, to its citizens).
I had a bottle of wine for dinner and I'm thinking I'm glad I have about 50 more bottles in the basement (home made ya know). Amazing that I can type as well as I think I can...
I am, folks, very terrified. I grew up under the shadow of duck and cover under my desk during the Cuban Missile Crisis (and by 4 grade I looked at the paper card hanging around my neck and my desk and knew that these preparations were bulls..hit! Somewhere in there the movie, On the Beach and also when I had small children The Next Day (or something like that in which even the people who knew what was happening had no where to run.)
Canada is a polite please and thank-you country. Few survivalists here (that I know about anyway). I wonder if I'm seeing the beginning of the end of life and luxury and civilization as I knew it.
Call me inebriated. Call me overly dramatic. Call me .....the voice that called wolf because there was a wolf.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 15, 2011 0:42:27 GMT -6
Paulette, ~hugs~ I really don't think there is anything to worry about... call me an idiot... some people do. They won't let radiation leak out. Trust me. The UN would get involved if other nations' safety became threatened by this. The leaking radiation (the chance of such a thing happening is very very small by the way because the nuclear "Core" of any nuclear power plant is protected by several layers of tightly-sealed shells... thus far only one of the plants had a rupture of the outer-most shell, not the inner shells) would be far more hazardous to the people in the immediate vicinity before it gets dispersed and diluted by hundreds of cubed miles of wind and water. ~hugs~ There is no reason to worry about it. I assure you that the worst case scenario will most likely not happen.
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Post by paulette on Mar 15, 2011 10:32:55 GMT -6
The second layer of one plant ruptured a little while ago. By the news reports there was a spike in radiation but fissionable materials have not been detected outside the plant. I can say now (stone cold sober thank you) that there are nuclear workers that are offering up the highest sacrifice right now - working in contaminated areas, trying to get vents open etc.
And there just was a 6. aftershock and earlier this am, a shock near Tokyo on a different fault line. I can only say that they must be issuing valium to the various TV news reporters because they manage to keep smiling and saying, "Oh that's normal in these situations" and (in the case of the Scots nuclear expert we've seen a lot of on our news channel), "Well the final outside case is still intact."
(listening to the news as I type) We are still advised not to worry about taking iodide. Since there isn't any available through normal sales anymore, I guess that's good advice.
OK. Lorelei, its not a matter of "letting" or not-letting the radiation leak out. If a reactor goes critical it melts down into the mantle of the earth (and spews out the top). Canada has already offered to send in nuclear scientists among a host of others. I don't think the offer has been accepted. Earlier in our history of being negligent monkeys an attempt was made to cap Chernobyl with a thick concrete cap. It turned to sand within weeks due to the intense radiation.
I personally am not remotely concerned about aliens at this point of history although a little help would be nice, if they have the inclination. Those supposedly seen hovering over nuclear sites - I wonder if any are hovering over Japan about now.
I do not believe that we will be told about things that we can't do much about (here in North America). Right now the Japanese civilians are being told to relocate further away or at least SEAL THEMSELVES in their homes. I guess putting duct tape and plastic bags on the windows gives one something to do....I hope its not my major line of defense. In fact I am 62 soon 63 and I care less about myself than all the young people, including but not only my family. I also care about all the innocent creatures of the earth that will pay the price of us having lots of electricity and gadgets. I guess I'm out of terror and into great sadness now.
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Post by skywalker on Mar 15, 2011 10:38:27 GMT -6
I agree with Lorelei. What is happening in Japan is nothing at all like what happened at Chernobyl. The reactors are of a totally different design and they have containment systems built in to prevent a huge radioactive disaster from occurring. As long as the containment system works then everything will be fine. Three Mile Island in Pennsylvania had a partial meltdown in 1979 and the containment system worked. The reactors in Japan are the same design and from the same time-period as the Three Mile Island one so they should theoretically function the same.
I don't think that anybody should start panicking yet. We are exposed to radiation every day as a natural part of living. The sun is constantly sending radiation towards us because it is a big giant nuclear reactor, the Earth is releasing radiation from it's core because it is made up of uranium and radium and all sorts of other radioactive materials. Every time we fly on a plane or get an x-ray or eat a banana we are exposing ourselves to additional amounts of radiation.
The radioactive gasses that they are releasing from Japan is minuscule compared to the amount of radiation naturally present on Earth, and by the time it gets anywhere near North America it will be so diluted that it will not even be detectable. They probably don't want people stocking up on Iodide here in the America's because the people in Japan are going to need it long before we would.
I would advise everybody to calm down. Having lived through the Cold War and all of the residue lefty over from the nuclear testing that went on back in the 1950s and 60s, not to mention the Three Mile Island accident and the Chernobyl disaster, I can assure you that we have faced much more serious events than those which are unfolding in Japan right now.
That is not to say that I am making light of the situation. I have seen pictures of the devastation that has occurred in Japan and I know how the people there are suffering. I also know what the dangers of nuclear radiation are. I have been to the testing grounds in Nevada, as well as to the Trinity Site in New Mexico where the first atomic bomb was detonated. I have held radioactive materials in my hand and felt the invisible power that was contained within them. I have done a lot of research into this subject, especially regarding the radiation experiments that were conducted back in the 50s and 60s using unsuspecting civilians as Guinea pigs. What went on back then is a heck of a lot worse than anything that is going on now.
People used to throw nuclear radiation around like it was a toy for their amusement, and a lot of people payed the price for it. We have learned a lot since those early days and have taken a lot of steps to prevent that type of reckless situation from ever occurring again. That is why nuclear energy is one of the most heavily regulated industries in the world.
I personally believe the situation in Japan will be contained and there is no reason for people to be panicking and thinking it is the end of the world...especially way over hear on the other side of the planet. What we should do is just take things one step at a time and deal with problems as they occur. Instead of worrying about what might happen let's concentrate on dealing with what has happened. It is the people in Japan, the ones who were hit hardest by the earthquake and tsunami, who need the most help right now. They are much worse off than we are over here. Let's do what we can to help them.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 15, 2011 10:45:10 GMT -6
I don't think it's time for us to worry but to be very concerned for the Japanese people. The last explosion did knock a hole in the 4 reactor containment unit and spent coolant was exposed....raising radiation levels but not into the immediate harmful zone. They've moved our carrier because it tested for radiation but just at minor levels and the Commander says he's ready to move it again if need be. They don't even know the extent of the melt down yet because it's too hot to look. The thing is..being afraid isn't going to help. If it comes to pass that this thing heads our way then we deal with it. I don't sense or 'feel' any panic about it and that's my weather vane. I do however grieve for those people who have lost every darned thing they had, are cold, hungry and exhausted. I have it very good indeed.
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sansseed
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Post by sansseed on Mar 15, 2011 13:05:36 GMT -6
The thing is..being afraid isn't going to help. If it comes to pass that this thing heads our way then we deal with it. I don't sense or 'feel' any panic about it and that's my weather vane. I do however grieve for those people who have lost every darned thing they had, are cold, hungry and exhausted. I have it very good indeed. So true! Every morning that I wake up and able to provide food, water, and shelter for my family, I am very thankful.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 15, 2011 13:58:26 GMT -6
Exactly Sanseed.. I figure if God has other plans for me he does.
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Post by paulette on Mar 16, 2011 9:55:38 GMT -6
Well...it continues to unpack, this disaster. The weather last night gave wind direction from across the Pacific Ocean and concluded that no radiation would reach us - maybe the US coast - Cal, Oregon.
Japanese folks who can leave are. The statement on our less-censored news source (CBC radio) said that they no longer trust that their government will tell them the full truth about the radiation. The nuclear team that Canada sent over returned because the radiation was too high to tolerate. The "team of 50" who have been trying to quell the heat and melt-down with seawater have been ordered out of the melt-down area. They are probably doomed already.
Since I am the only one here who seems to be focused on this subject and that my interest in ghosts, UFOs and such has been sidelined I think I will give it a rest for a while. For what its worth, I care about you guys.
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sansseed
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Post by sansseed on Mar 16, 2011 11:00:32 GMT -6
Paulette, I heard one reporter this morning say that the "experts" think it is highly unlikely for the radiation to reach our coasts. Yet, I have to ask, how do these experts KNOW. I mean, none of us know how this disaster is going to play out. Right now, all we have are theories and possible scenarios. If you are worried, and want to take measures to protect yourself and your family, then do it. It is better to be safe than sorry.
I remember, while working for the airlines, a gate agent telling a gentleman (and I use that term loosely), who was upset that his flight was delayed, "would you rather be on the ground wishing you were in the air, or would you rather be in the air and wishing you were on the ground?" This pretty much shut the guy up because it puts things in perspective. This line has always stuck with me, and I always think of it whenever I become worried about situations. It puts things in perspective.
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Post by skywalker on Mar 16, 2011 11:29:46 GMT -6
Well...it continues to unpack, this disaster. The weather last night gave wind direction from across the Pacific Ocean and concluded that no radiation would reach us - maybe the US coast - Cal, Oregon. Japanese folks who can leave are. The statement on our less-censored news source (CBC radio) said that they no longer trust that their government will tell them the full truth about the radiation. The nuclear team that Canada sent over returned because the radiation was too high to tolerate. The "team of 50" who have been trying to quell the heat and melt-down with seawater have been ordered out of the melt-down area. They are probably doomed already. Since I am the only one here who seems to be focused on this subject and that my interest in ghosts, UFOs and such has been sidelined I think I will give it a rest for a while. For what its worth, I care about you guys. There are quite a few people interested in this topic, Paulette. I'm just trying to get the facts instead of the usual hysteria-promoting nonsense that comes from the news media. I think there are some people who are blowing this thing way out of proportion in order to promote their own agendas, whether it be to sell more papers or increase their political power. I also think there are some people who are down-playing the problem in order to promote their agendas which is probably to cover their own rear-ends. It will probably be months or even years after this disaster is over before we finally find out the truth about it.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 16, 2011 14:11:56 GMT -6
I'm interested in the topic also..in fact I've sidelined about everything else while watching the news. I'm in agony for the Japanese people because they're terrified. I just happen to be one of those people who figure that if it heads this way..we'll do all we can. Beyond that..worrying about radiation on it's way isn't going to help me live my day. When I was 16 I gave myself an ulcer worrying about people pushing 'the button'. That was about time the book 'On the Beach' came out'. I told myself that never again would I agonize over something I have no control over. My faith is strong..and I have no 'sense' of impending doom. I don't mean to minimize it for anyone else however. We all have our own ways of dealing with threats and we need to respect that I think. Meantime..I could care less if a UFO landed on the lawn..I do care about a people in crisis
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Post by mdaisy on Mar 16, 2011 14:23:12 GMT -6
I am more worried about the increased unrest in the Middle East than I am of the Japanese nuclear situation. The Japanese nuke stations do have cement covers nearby and they can be used to prevent radiation from leaking. Chernobyl did not have these covers and the area was inundated with radiation.
I am concerned for the short-term welfare of the Japanese as most do not have a way to escape the area as best as I can tell.
If you live in Canada, even if you lived near the British Columbia coastline, there would be little to worry about. I live on the west coast in the California desert and I am not worried.
I do have my earthquake kit, and I will be adding some updated supplies, because I do expect the Ring of Fire to "adjust" after the massive Japanese earthquake. It's just how these things go.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 16, 2011 15:17:22 GMT -6
I am more worried about the increased unrest in the Middle East than I am of the Japanese nuclear situation. The Japanese nuke stations do have cement covers nearby and they can be used to prevent radiation from leaking. Chernobyl did not have these covers and the area was inundated with radiation. I am concerned for the short-term welfare of the Japanese as most do not have a way to escape the area as best as I can tell. If you live in Canada, even if you lived near the British Columbia coastline, there would be little to worry about. I live on the west coast in the California desert and I am not worried. I do have my earthquake kit, and I will be adding some updated supplies, because I do expect the Ring of Fire to "adjust" after the massive Japanese earthquake. It's just how these things go. Yes... I've been expecting a big quake here too mdaisy. Thankfully winter time is almost over and things have warmed up above zero here in Interior Alaska recently... Thankfully the population of people in my area is spread out and we are a "small town". It seems densely populated areas are more drastically affected by large quakes than places like here... also... all of our buildings are designed to withstand big quakes... my house included... when we had the 7.9 quake 8 years ago nothing collapsed... I don't want to be in the new Wal-Mart building when the big one comes... because it was built by "outside" contractors and the parking lot flooded the first spring after they built it because they didn't realize that all of the snow melts at the same time apparently... ~rolls eyes~ ...I'm pretty sure they didn't make their building earthquake-resistant either... I'm glad I don't work there... I would hate to be at work too when the quake comes... I'll be mopping wine and sweeping glass off the floor for hours... lol...
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Post by mdaisy on Mar 16, 2011 16:25:34 GMT -6
I am more worried about the increased unrest in the Middle East than I am of the Japanese nuclear situation. The Japanese nuke stations do have cement covers nearby and they can be used to prevent radiation from leaking. Chernobyl did not have these covers and the area was inundated with radiation. I am concerned for the short-term welfare of the Japanese as most do not have a way to escape the area as best as I can tell. If you live in Canada, even if you lived near the British Columbia coastline, there would be little to worry about. I live on the west coast in the California desert and I am not worried. I do have my earthquake kit, and I will be adding some updated supplies, because I do expect the Ring of Fire to "adjust" after the massive Japanese earthquake. It's just how these things go. Yes... I've been expecting a big quake here too mdaisy. Thankfully winter time is almost over and things have warmed up above zero here in Interior Alaska recently... Thankfully the population of people in my area is spread out and we are a "small town". It seems densely populated areas are more drastically affected by large quakes than places like here... also... all of our buildings are designed to withstand big quakes... my house included... when we had the 7.9 quake 8 years ago nothing collapsed... I don't want to be in the new Wal-Mart building when the big one comes... because it was built by "outside" contractors and the parking lot flooded the first spring after they built it because they didn't realize that all of the snow melts at the same time apparently... ~rolls eyes~ ...I'm pretty sure they didn't make their building earthquake-resistant either... I'm glad I don't work there... I would hate to be at work too when the quake comes... I'll be mopping wine and sweeping glass off the floor for hours... lol... Sounds like Wal Mart. A former Wal Mart employee told me that clerks were supposed to shepherd the customers to the soft goods department during an earthquake. You can tell the folks in Arkansas have never been in an earthquake Long ago we tried to tell the employees it was not a good idea to stack cases of soda pop outside during a parking lot sale. It was over 100 degrees plus outside. Of course the soda cans started blowing up in the heat.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 16, 2011 17:10:46 GMT -6
I live 30 miles north of San Diego M Daisy..always expecting the next one..lol
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Post by Morgan Sierra on Mar 17, 2011 11:43:08 GMT -6
Truth at last. After scouring the Internet and the news media for days trying to find out some truth about what is going on with the nuclear reactors in Japan I have finally found some accurate information. This comes from the Nuclear Energy Institute, whose job it is to moniter the production of nuclear energy around the world. This is what there website says about the current situation. www.nei.org/newsandevents/information-on-the-japanese-earthquake-and-reactors-in-that-region/UPDATE AS OF 11:35 A.M. EDT, THURSDAY, MARCH 17:
Fukushima Daiichi The reactors at the Fukushima Daiichi plant are in stable condition and are being cooled with seawater, but workers at the plant continue efforts to add cooling water to fuel pools at reactors 3 and 4.
The status of the reactors at the site is as follows:
Reactor 1’s primary containment is believed to be intact and the reactor is in a stable condition. Seawater injection into the reactor is continuing.
Reactor 2 is in stable condition with seawater injection continuing. The reactor’s primary containment may not have been breached, Tokyo Electric Power Co. and World Association of Nuclear Operators officials said on Thursday.
Access problems at the site have delayed connection of a temporary cable to restore off-site electricity. The connection will provide power to the control rod drive pump, instrumentation, batteries and the control room. Power has not been available at the site since the earthquake on March 11.
Reactor 3 is in stable condition with seawater injection continuing. The primary containment is believed to be intact. Pressure in the containment has fluctuated due to venting of the reactor containment structure.
TEPCO officials say that although one side of the concrete wall of the fuel pool structure has collapsed, the steel liner of the pool remains intact, based on aerial photos of the reactor taken on March 17. The pool still has water providing some cooling for the fuel; however, helicopters dropped water on the reactor four times during the morning (Japan time) on March 17. Water also was sprayed at reactor 4 using high-pressure water cannons.
Reactors 5 and 6 were both shut down before the quake occurred. Primary and secondary containments are intact at both reactors. Temperature instruments in the spent fuel pools at reactors 5 and 6 are operational, and temperatures are being maintained at about 62 degrees Celsius. TEPCO is continuing efforts to restore power at reactor 5.
Fukushima Daini All four reactors at the Fukushima Daini plant have reached cold shutdown conditions with normal cooling being maintained using residual heat removal systems.
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