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Post by Deleted on Oct 22, 2011 16:50:50 GMT -6
I agree that things have become more "Stirred up".
Wow... I hadn't heard about the boy scouts thing yet. That's kind of... in the words of my generation, "Messed up, man!"
According to a facebook poll... as it stands now, the question is "Will Occupy Wall Street or the Tea Party have a bigger impact on the country?" the choices are "The Tea Party" "The OCW" and "There's gotta be a better option." Right now... OCW has 216 votes and the Tea Party has 1,065 votes. The third option has 307. ~shrug~
I don't believe the media and our political leaders are being truthful about this "global revolution". Facebook peeps seem to favor the Tea Party more than the OCW.
Funny really. When the Tea Party first got started, Obama laughed at them and called them "Tea Baggers" using a gay sexual reference to describe them which I found to be extremely distasteful and disgusting. Now that the OCW movement is getting started, Obama comes on there and says the he empathizes with their feelings and he thinks they are the same as the Tea Party. He says he feels for the American People and their frustrations.
Hmm... why is he changing his mind all of a sudden? Methinks he is up to something and that something is NOT good...
Right now, 95,201 people like the OCW facebook page.
Right now, 849,756 people like the Tea Party Patriots facebook page.
A vast majority of the Tea Party Patriots do not condone the OCW movement. They say they are trying to start a socialist revolution, whereas the OCW people say the Tea Party Patriots are a bunch of "Racist Nazis". Each group disagrees with and borderline hates the other group. I've been keeping track on facebook because, to be honest, I trust the American People to tell me the truth... not the media and not political figures.
Very interesting, wouldn't you say? It seems the media and Obama want us to go along with the OCW... but most of us aren't. Many reporters have reported that at the Occupy protests, the journalists outnumber the protesters... lol...
There is a LOT of fighting lately. The republican presidential debate has been getting pretty ugly too...
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Post by skywalker on Oct 22, 2011 20:38:08 GMT -6
I don't care if politicians beat the crap out of each other. Maybe they will all kill each other and put the rest of the country out of its misery. Things would be fine if the government wasn't screwing everything up. I think that goes for most of the rest of the countries around the world too.
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Post by paulette on Oct 23, 2011 12:18:23 GMT -6
Skywalker! Do you think we'd do better without government? Someone famous said, "Democracy is a bad system but its the best we have." (or something like that) People continue to set up power over systems - over their neighbors, the people on the other side of the river, etc. If Canada had representational democracy (like New Zealand now has) we would not have had the Prime Ministers we did and do for the last 20 years - the west coast votes might as well not be counted as we are outweighed by Eastern Canada.
And in another discouraging scenario - Libya just killed a corrupt dictator (who was supported by the US for years). And now it becomes apparent why - the country is already under Shia law. No more women in the streets (whether they fought for liberation or not). They're already all wearing tents with embroidered eye holes.
We are just mean monkeys with weapons. Which is why an intergalactic traveler would be VERY CAREFUL in contacting us without wiping our memories....
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Post by Deleted on Oct 24, 2011 10:05:11 GMT -6
That is EXACTLY what I've been saying Paulette..only I love the mean monkey's with weapons analogy much better than my wordy descriptions ;D I keep falling back on why...any intelligent species would try to put a saddle on a race of people known best for the atrocities they commit. Serial killers, genocides, racial bigotry, religious bigotry and more. First kids in the bible were noted for the murder of one Unless...they are as bad as we are...or worse. Granted...politics bring out greed and corruption in people but it's more disturbing to me to read about a gunman opening fire on a school or bus or shopping center (which is happening a lot more often). People are coming forward with their stories of being molested in the boy scouts or by priests...or by their own parents...and it had nothing to do with this administration. I don't like their policies..I think the president is a weak and ineffectual man and no agent for the people but what is more important..your tax dollars or the guy next door who's building a bomb in his garage? Definitely I believe we need to keep our focus on our own people and let other races develop without our influence but from the other point of view..they try to consider 'future' relations and future threats to us. It doesn't work..most countries despise us and it depletes our own financial structure however...there still is said something to be considered in trying to maintain a 'top dog' image. You could not pay me enough money to be a president
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Post by skywalker on Oct 24, 2011 10:17:29 GMT -6
Skywalker! Do you think we'd do better without government? Someone famous said, "Democracy is a bad system but its the best we have." (or something like that) People continue to set up power over systems - over their neighbors, the people on the other side of the river, etc. If Canada had representational democracy (like New Zealand now has) we would not have had the Prime Ministers we did and do for the last 20 years - the west coast votes might as well not be counted as we are outweighed by Eastern Canada. And in another discouraging scenario - Libya just killed a corrupt dictator (who was supported by the US for years). And now it becomes apparent why - the country is already under Shia law. No more women in the streets (whether they fought for liberation or not). They're already all wearing tents with embroidered eye holes. We are just mean monkeys with weapons. Which is why an intergalactic traveler would be VERY CAREFUL in contacting us without wiping our memories.... The system of government that we have would be an excellent system if it were running the way it was designed to. Unfortunately it isn't because there are a bunch of politicians who are doing everything they possibly can to manipulate the people and gain power. They lie to the people, deceive the people, use and abuse the people...all for their own selfish personal interests. That's why things are so screwed up. It's not government that is bad, just the people who are controlling it. We need to get rid of the power-hungry fools and replace them with people who are good, honest and decent. Everything would be fine if we did that.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 24, 2011 14:32:03 GMT -6
I was listening to the radio this morning. The Pope was asked what he thought about the Occupy movement (which still, according to Facebook is very low in numbers compared to the Tea Party movement).
The Pope said he empathizes with the protesters and he is all for a "One World Government" which will "alleviate" the problems we are currently experiencing...
...
I'm in helll. This is hellll.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 24, 2011 23:41:04 GMT -6
A great idea Sky but where would we get those people to run the government as it was meant to run? And who will decide how it should be run? The problem isn't just the elected officials..it's the division of parties that are never in accord. You see it one way...your neighbor sees it exactly the opposite way. And if people could agree on the best representatives..where would they be found..these uncorruptible, ungreedy, selfless souls? Those..we'd have to import from other planets because I am sure...they do not exist here on earth. We still have a vestige of freedom left but thanks to terrorism that's shrinking at an alarming rate. I don't think there is a fix anymore
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Post by skywalker on Oct 25, 2011 7:02:16 GMT -6
There are a lot of good people in the country they are just not involved with politics, and they probably never will be because the people who control the political system are a bunch of selfish, power-hungry SoBs. The problem that we are in today has been building for a long time. We are now at the culmination of over 200 years of gradual political corruption, and it extends all the way into other areas such as the news media and the education system. We are in a situation where 10% of the people are controlling the other 90% simply because the 10% are all working together to help each other achieve their goals. Sooner or later the vast majority are going to get tired of it all and they will do something about it. I think we are on the verge of doing that now. It just takes time.
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Post by paulette on Oct 25, 2011 19:07:30 GMT -6
Well...I'll go with the hopeful bit at the end.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 25, 2011 23:09:16 GMT -6
As far as government goes..I've noted that if someone goes against the 'in crowd' they end up with a quick ticket to the after life. There aren't many who still like Obama but he did manage to get elected in spite of elements that should have made that improbable. Tell me there isn't a government unseen behind the one we know and love to defame
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Post by Deleted on Oct 25, 2011 23:37:17 GMT -6
America is one of the wealthiest countries in the world. Its citizens who make more than $30,000 a year are in the top 10% of people in the entire world.
The people who are marching and screaming for more government control over their lives have access to housing, food, and clean water... which is more than most truly poverty stricken people in the world can say they have access to.
This is reminding me of the fall of Rome... this is EXACTLY what happened in Rome before it collapsed... the people of Rome believed they were entitled to extravagant things which they did not need... things which they could not afford... and so the government went bankrupt. They started fighting one another in the streets... but they weren't fighting over politics. They were fighting over religion. They were too selfish to see what was going on elsewhere in the world, and they failed to see their own economy collapsing. They failed to see the enemy "barbarians" slowly approaching them from the North... the same "barbarians" who destroyed and enslaved them because they were too busy fighting amongst themselves to see it coming.
Rome is falling again- and the media and politicians are just fueling the fire to make it go faster. They WANT it to happen... either that or they are truly as igannant as they seem to be...
So while those people are in the street screaming that they want more money, while they are screaming that they want all the money from the rich- they truly do not realize how lucky they are to have the things they have now. They will not have these things if the economy and the governement collapse... then they will truly know what being hungry is all about...
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Post by paulette on Oct 26, 2011 18:26:43 GMT -6
Passionately spoken Lorelei. However the people in streets are not all folks who merely want more money. Many are those who had jobs that disappeared, that had houses that disappeared and whose children (as well as themselves) are in shock, hungry and maybe sleeping in a car.
Here in my small part of the planet - we have more and more homeless. Some are young to middle-aged people who look like they could work are probably drug and/or alcohol addicted. Some are mentally ill or head injured (the two groups aren't exclusive). Many inhouse services have closed here. One has to have it together to fill out the paper work and find a temporary address etc etc. Being schizophrenic and drunk does not make this a likely process to succeed at. I see little half-collapsed tents in the rain. Sleeping homeless people are in them - behind fences, on vacant lots, etc. It does not look like happy camping to me.
There was a campground that has allowed the bottom of rung folks to camp there. They traded and shared old RV vehicles and leaky trailers - with giant tarps over them. The city wants to kick them out because they are in a possible flood area. But the plans to build a homeless shelter here were dragged out and killed in the back room by NIMBY businesses. I actually think they hope the annoyingly unemployed and unhoused will die (some do every year). This is a crime against humanity. Yes there are some slackers in the ranks. But isn't a person by virture of not coping well enough to care for themselves deserving of help?
Corporations do not pay taxes. No taxes. They get "tax breaks" and incentives. Lower middle class carry the load. It is quicky disappearing here in Canada. If I wasn't married and being supported (mostly) I might be in a tent as well! My income has dropped by a third - the positions are being outsourced by telephone and computer folks of dubious credentials in other parts of Canada and working for a fraction of what I have to charge to maintain an office and staff (to see people in person). People working from their computers can work alone. I cannot see people in an empty building. Not safe for either of us (I am open to claims of misconduct under those circumstances).
I feel passionate about all this as well.
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Post by skywalker on Oct 26, 2011 18:40:36 GMT -6
Would you all mind if I moved this political conversation to a separate thread?
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Post by Deleted on Oct 26, 2011 18:46:32 GMT -6
That's a good idea sky.
Paulette, I have to disagree with you on this hun.
I don't know about Canada, but in the US, the top 1% contributes about 70% (some will say 69%) of the total federal income tax. Only 30% of the total tax revenue of the US comes from the 99%. This is a fact. The top 1% do indeed pay taxes. They do indeed pay a lot.
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Post by skywalker on Oct 26, 2011 19:36:42 GMT -6
I have been trying very hard to stay out of any political discussions because politics makes my blood boil. The few times I have made comments about politics I have had to restrain myself because I don't want to throw a temper tantrum like I usually do. I am continuing to be restrained. I agree with what everybody here is saying. Each person makes some very good points. I think that some wealthy people do pay way too much in taxes and there are some who get away with paying nothing at all because they have the political influence to buy or bribe their way out of it. I also think that the middle class are the ones who are really being targeted. Those in the middle have just enough money that it can be taken away but not enough to buy influence. They always end up getting screwed the worst. The poor are just used as pawns...they are given just enough money to buy their votes but not enough that they will ever be able to get out of poverty. They are being kept poor on purpose. I think the problem boils down to the fact that the government is taking way too much money away from the people and they are wasting the vast majority of it. All of the problems that each of you have cited could be solved if the politicians would just spend money responsibly and wisely. All of the homeless people could easily be fed, housed, educated and employed with a tiny fraction of the money that is wasted each year. We just need to have honest and responsible people in charge of the governments. Bad government is where the real problem is. Now that I am through being restrained I am going to say what I really feel about politicians...mmphh *#$$ frumbin *@&*#&% ratsin frackin $%^$$% @@#!!!
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Post by Deleted on Oct 26, 2011 19:53:59 GMT -6
I can definitely see this from both perspectives, but I firmly believe that taxing the rich more is not the answer to this problem. I believe this will create a whole hornet's nest of new problems. History has proven this to be true. Look what happened to Russia...
The world would be a much better place if greed was not a part of human nature... but alas, this will never be so. That's why we were kicked out of Eden in the first place you know. We just couldn't follow the rules... and we never will be able to.
Greed is not taught in school. Sharing is taught in kindergarten. Why? Because nobody has to be taught how to be selfish because we all are, and this is a natural thing with us, it always has been.
The main problem with the world right now is overpopulation IMO. There are more people than jobs to do.
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Post by skywalker on Oct 26, 2011 20:31:36 GMT -6
Raising taxes, no matter who it is on, is not the answer because government is not the answer. At this point in time government is the problem rather than the solution. Most of the problems we are facing right now were caused either directly or indirectly by government interference. If we could just get the federal government under control and out of the way we could solve most of the problems that we have. The people can fix all of these problems...just not with corrupt, abusive power-hungry politicians constantly screwing things up worse. We need to put a stop to this out of control government.
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Post by paulette on Oct 26, 2011 22:06:56 GMT -6
Would you all mind if I moved this political conversation to a separate thread? Do it. This has nothing to do with astrology.
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Post by skywalker on Oct 26, 2011 22:35:27 GMT -6
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Post by Deleted on Oct 27, 2011 0:15:55 GMT -6
I'm going to agree Sky that politics are pretty 'hot' for a forum on the paranormal still...some of what we discuss here are conspiracies..and well..the government IS a pretty likely candidate. Maybe we should try to localize our selves to government conspiracies and not political preferences. I'm not sure visitors from other planets or dimensions will particularly care which inept fool is in office (I didn't just say that). For all I know they voted the present guy into office..I sure didn't ;D
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Post by skywalker on Oct 27, 2011 9:56:31 GMT -6
Since the government is so intrusive into people's lives and so determined to take control of everything it is hard to discuss anything that doesn't involve them in some way or another. Most of the problems we have now can be traced back either directly or indirectly to the Feds. The bigger they get the more complicated everything becomes. I've been trying to get my drivers license renewed since May and thanks to the new federal regulations they still have not gotten it done right.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 27, 2011 10:18:46 GMT -6
I'm just so sick and tired of being lied to by the media... they lie about UFOs... they lie about what's going on in Washington, they're lying about the OCW protests, they just lie and lie and lie and people just go along with it and blindly believe it all... According to the latest facebook gossip, whether it is true or not, Iran is now supporting the OCW. Of course they are. They want to see us start a civil war and tear ourselves apart. I'm sorry if I offended anyone, I was trying to be impartial but it didn't come out that way. I am very afraid of what the future may hold for the US. I dislike what I am seeing and hearing. Greed is a terrible thing... now everybody wants to be pointing fingers they just can't decide who they want to point their fingers at. The truth of the matter is that all of this is EVERYONE's fault... not just Wall Street, not just the government, not just one president in particular. People are angry and they're not sure who to blame. This is what is happening right now. It is a complicated mess that has been going down over the time span of decades. What we need to do is stop the name calling and finger pointing and we need to stand together and elect people who can help us fix this problem we have all helped to create. Fighting among ourselves is the wrong thing to be doing right now.
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Post by skywalker on Oct 28, 2011 9:25:12 GMT -6
I don't think you offended anybody, Lorelei. I think everybody who has taken part in this discussion has been very polite and respectful. That is the way discussions should be. People don't always have to agree with each other.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 23, 2012 2:35:09 GMT -6
Yea, the media are great aren't they? Check out this video... hilarious! Obama is such a brilliant orator and he's such an intellectual!
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Post by paulette on Mar 23, 2012 9:11:35 GMT -6
If Obama bashing is acceptable content here then wind me up because I have things to say about cancelling healthcare for women, having to report to one's boss if one is on contraceptives ("slut pills) and other actions of the OTHER SIDE. Seriously...
But I'm hoping that this will not become a political forum. Because we won't want to talk to each other and share our stories once that gets going. Do it on FB! Then people who don't want to hear it can "unfriend" you or erase your posts.
I am in DESPAIR over the politics of the USA and also Canada. I believe we are going into a DARK AGE of intolerance and igannance (reflected by Islamic fundamentalism). I LOVE you guys and gals. Don't do this please.
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Post by Steve on Mar 23, 2012 10:50:49 GMT -6
If Obama bashing is acceptable content here then wind me up because I have things to say about cancelling healthcare for women, having to report to one's boss if one is on contraceptives ("slut pills) and other actions of the OTHER SIDE. Seriously... But I'm hoping that this will not become a political forum. Because we won't want to talk to each other and share our stories once that gets going. Do it on FB! Then people who don't want to hear it can "unfriend" you or erase your posts. I am in DESPAIR over the politics of the USA and also Canada. I believe we are going into a DARK AGE of intolerance and igannance (reflected by Islamic fundamentalism). I LOVE you guys and gals. Don't do this please. I totally agree with you Paulette. Steve
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Post by auntym on Mar 23, 2012 11:53:30 GMT -6
If Obama bashing is acceptable content here then wind me up because I have things to say about cancelling healthcare for women, having to report to one's boss if one is on contraceptives ("slut pills) and other actions of the OTHER SIDE. Seriously... But I'm hoping that this will not become a political forum. Because we won't want to talk to each other and share our stories once that gets going. Do it on FB! Then people who don't want to hear it can "unfriend" you or erase your posts. I am in DESPAIR over the politics of the USA and also Canada. I believe we are going into a DARK AGE of intolerance and igannance (reflected by Islamic fundamentalism). I LOVE you guys and gals. Don't do this please. I totally agree with you Paulette. Steve I AGREE.... PLEASE KEEP YOUR POLITICAL COMMENTS TO YOURSELF .....
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Post by Deleted on Mar 23, 2012 13:21:06 GMT -6
I thought we were bashing the media here... and I thought that was what I was doing. This video is making fun of the media...
Well I suppose I could find another example of what the media does, but this one is the most obvious one I could think of.
I posted the video because it provides an example of the media saying what they want you to hear and skimming over the stuff they don't want you to hear. They do the same thing with the UFO phenomenon. They do it with everything.
I did not intend to start an Obama "bashing" session by posting this video. I was hoping for a Media "bashing" session which was what Mr. Reed's previous posts were about.
Paulette, I love you too and I value the things you say and your beliefs, but I do not always agree with a lot of the things you post. Some of the things you have posted have made me angry as well, but I didn't ask you to remove any of it. I simply told you that I did not agree.
I understand this is a sensitive subject for a lot of people and our country is in upheaval over things of this nature. There are very strong feelings on both sides.
Paulette, Steve, if you want me to remove the video, I will with no hard feelings. I didn't intend to get anyone upset or start a fight.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 23, 2012 13:24:40 GMT -6
On facebook, half of my friends are liberals and they are people I have known since high school and college in some cases. I post these things all the time and nobody ever gets into an argument or a fight and nobody has "un-friended" me for posting these things. Do you know why? Because that's what mature and responsible adults do. We accept one another for our differences and do not hold the opinions of our friends against them.
That kind of thinking (intolerance and censorship) IMO is what causes civil wars.
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Post by paulette on Mar 23, 2012 16:59:29 GMT -6
Value your friendship Lorelei. Not telling you what to do. Don't want to talk politics and hope this forum steers clear of them. Sorry you have been angry about some things I wrote. Open to talk about it - pm works too.
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